Rabbi Charlie Rabinowitz and Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner, co-editors of the Journal of Jewish Spiritual Care, discuss the Journal's recent reboot and the role it plays in advancing the field of Jewish spiritual care.
The Journal of Jewish Spiritual Care can be found here.
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About Our Guests:
Rabbi Charles P. Rabinowitz, BCC, provides home hospice and palliative care services for Caring Hospice Services of New York. Rabbi Rabinowitz holds ordinations as both Rabbi and Dayan from Tifereth Israel Rabbinical Seminary. He has written extensively on narrative psychology, clinical pastoral psychology and education, comfort fatigue/secondary stress, end-of-life cultural and communication issues for dementia patients and their families in a home hospice setting, Biblical and Judaic studies. He is the 100th generation of rabbis in his family (Hillel is at the bottom of the trunk.) Rabbi Rabinowitz is also certified in Palliative Care Chaplaincy.
Rabbi Kinzbrunner is the owner of New Beginnings Spiritual Coaching and Consulting LLC, helping people on the journey through the waves of life. Bryan is an experienced Spiritual Care chaplain with over 15 years of experience working in Senior Care and Hospice. He has semicha/ordination from Yeshiva University. Bryan has spent his career working closely with people on areas of spirituality, grief and loss and transitions. He is passionate about helping others discover their authentic, spiritual selves.
About our host:
Rabbi Edward Bernstein, PBCC, is the producer and host of NeshamaCast. He serves as Chaplain at Boca Raton Regional Hospital of Baptist Health South Florida. He is a member of the Board of Neshama: Association of Jewish Chaplains. Prior to his chaplain career, he served as a pulpit rabbi in congregations in New Rochelle, NY; Beachwood, OH; and Boynton Beach, FL. He is also the host and producer of My Teacher Podcast: A Celebration of the People Who Shape Our Lives.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: Shalom and welcome to NeshamaCast, exploring Jewish spiritual care today. Brought to you by Neshama, Association of Jewish Chaplains. I'm your host, Rabbi Ed Bernstein.
As noted previously on NashamaCast, Jewish chaplains are trained both in the wisdom of Jewish tradition and in evidence based practices of spiritual care. Recently Nashama Association of Jewish Chaplains rebooted the publication of the Journal of Jewish Spiritual Care. Today's guests on Nashama cast are the 2 editors of the Journal Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz and Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz provides home hospice and palliative care services for Caring Hospice services of New York. Rabbi Rabinowitz was ordained at Tifereth Israel Rabbinical Seminary. He has written extensively on narrative, psychology, clinical, pastoral psychology, and education, and several other topics. He resides in Larchmont, New York, and I'm honoured to serve with Charlie on the board of Neshama Association of Jewish Chaplains.
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner is the owner of New Beginnings, Spiritual Coaching and Consulting LLC. Helping people on the journey through the waves of life. He has rabbinical ordination from Yeshiva University, and is a past president of NAJC. He makes his home in Highland Park, New Jersey, and I'll add that both of our guests are board certified chaplains. Charlie and Bryan. Welcome to NashamaCast it so good to have you both.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: Thank you.
RabbI Bryan Kinzbrunner: Thank you, Ed. Ed, it's a pleasure to be on this podcast. And having listened to a few of them so far, I'm very excited to be able to participate and share today.
Rabbi Edward Bernstein: Well, thank you. You know, NAJC has expanded its media empire, such as it is. In the past few months we've launched NeshamaCast and our organization has rebooted the Journal of Jewish Spiritual Care which is our focus today. So it's really an honor to join you in this effort of bringing the Torah the wisdom of NAJC and the Torah of Jewish spiritual care to a wider audience.
I'm always fascinated by the origin stories of our NAJC colleagues, so I'd like to start with a bit of your spiritual and religious origin stories. What was your spiritual life like growing up? And what was the path that led you to becoming rabbis and board certified chaplains. Charlie, let's start with you. I'll just add that you know my father is a genealogist. So it caught my eye to read that you represent the one hundredth generation of rabbis in your family. Can you tell us more about that and the journey that led you to be a Rabbi and Chaplain.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: Well. our family tree starts with Hillel. and it's been a continuous generation to generation. Rabbi and dayyan [religious judge]. They travelled from Barcelona, Spain, and then north through Holland, and then into Germany, and then eventually into Lithuania. On my mother's side is the Vilna Gaon and Moses Isserlis, and there was never any doubt what I was gonna be. My father always told the story that when his father was dying he made his son promise that when I was old enough to go to Rabbinical School, that I would not go to Hebrew Union College, it scared him, that I would go to Tiferet Israel which was founded by my ancestors. My grandfather and my father were chairs of the Talmud department, and the clinical pastoral psychology departments.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: Can you say a word of where Tiferet Israel is on the Jewish communal landscape in terms of its orientation.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: It's a transplanted Lithuanian Musar Yeshiva, it is no longer in existence.And you know, even though I was brought up in the Reform movement, it was understood that when it came time that I would go to the family yeshiva which’s curriculum was a little bit different. It was one third clinical pastoral psychology, it was one third traditional Lithuanian musar stuff and an exact copy of the New York campus of Hebrew Union College coursework. It is a responsibility, and it is a calling, I mean my grandfather and father served at Calvary Hospital in the Bronx, over 40 years apiece. And about 3 months ago one of my patients said who knew who had met my father, so how many years has your family been doing rabbinic palliative hospice chaplaincy? And I realized it was over 120 years.
Rabbi Edward Bernstein: Tell me more about your journey and chaplaincy. Briefly, how did how did you? How were you drawn to that particular line of rabbinic work?
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: From the time I could walk Sunday afternoons were spent at Calvary with Dad. And you know the nurses used to kid me that they knew when Dad was at the bottom of his chaplains toolbox, because suddenly you'd hear a little boy soprano voice singing to the patients. When I went to Leo Beck College in London, Dad arranged for me to spend one afternoon a week with Dame Peggy, who was the founder of the modern Hospice movement at St. Christopher's in London. Basically, I've been wandering the halls of well, you know hospitals and hospices since I was about 2 years old. Like my grandfather and I were pulpit rabbi and chaplains. So I did both for about 18 years. But it's sort of a natural part of being for me, you know. It's it's something I've always done and been involved in. And you know, every once in a while I've come across a patient, you know in a hospital. or even in my current job. that you know, I'll walk in the room when they start jump a little bit, because I look like my dad. My dad had this habit that he would take a picture of one of the children in the family, and him and the families would send it north to Manhattan. And Dad would write a prayer on the back and tell the families that whenever any of their family ended up in a hospital, or were ill or in hospice at home, that to stick it in the in the nightstand, and there would be a covering of peace, a sukkat shalom, over the patient and the family.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein:Beautiful imagery and wonderful stories of both the connection to to elders and prior generations. And also you're forging your own particular path in palliative care.
Bryan. What's your backstory?
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: Like Charlie. There's a little bit of a generational overlap or continuation, I should say but ours is a little bit different. I grew up in Florida. Long story short, is II have recollections, my brothers, do not that we started off your typical, non-affiliated American family, American Jewish family. A few years later, when I was in elementary school, we started a journey back that began actually in the Conservative Jewish movement for a little bit and then eventually, we, we being my parents, and then obviously all of us as children when became more connected through Chabad and more orthodox over the years. So I kind of got to see a little bit of the worlds beyond, like those 4 walls, if you will, that some people imagine in the orthodox world but for me personally, and you know, as any kid would go through, that's a lot of challenge and a lot of change.
But already by high school I had this inkling of. I really like this Jewish stuff If you will. I hate to put in such simple terms. I had always had this inkling to potentially go and become a rabbi after some back and forth and struggle on that and I would have to be honest, It was an interesting challenge to want to take on those responsibilities in life. I decided to forge ahead. I went to Yeshiva University, where I spent my undergraduate years and my years in Rabbinic ordination and a Master's degree in in Jewish studies while I was there as well. And while I was doing my Rabbinic studies to become a rabbi, I was trying to figure, where do I want to land? I always had a good inclination towards helping others which I didn't always see. But others did see in me and yet I just didn't know if I wanted to teach. If I wanted to be a rabbi of a synagogue and I kind of tried out the teaching thing for a little bit. It didn't really go so well when I, in my early twenties and in the course of a conversation one day with my father, who had risen through the ranks, and one of the largest National Hospice companies in the United States to become the chief medical officer the Hospice was V. Is Vitas healthcare. So, he suggested: What about Chaplaincy? It touches on a lot of your strengths, and it's an opportunity.
Like Charlie, though I had had experiences with Hospice going back to when I was a young child in the sense that I also remember being on the hospice wing. Didn't do the work he did. I didn't do a whole chaplaincy bit really was just there, I think, because my father was doing his rounds, and we had to be there, but I remember it and it was in the early eighties when Hospice was just becoming a thing in the United States. And I even remember when I was growing up, and people asked me: What did your father do? I couldn't really explain it, but Hospice was always part of the language in our house, so he had suggested chaplaincy, and I did it through Hospice. That's where I started. Worked in that for about 5 years, just alone. Moved forward into senior care, and the wide gamut of what that was for 11 years.
And then my journey actually took a turn in 2021, when I decided for a lot of personal reasons to try to venture out on my own and try my own new beginning, which is why I named my spiritual coaching company that was a new beginning for me, and a new beginning that I wanted to help others find as well. And so over the past couple of years I've been building that coaching company as well as finding myself actually back in the education world a little bit in a more. I'll call it a chaplainy kind of role. It's guidance counseling, but it it's clearly the same skill base just on a different part of the life journey, meaning the, you know, earlier, I work with elementary middle school students as opposed to people and the latter half of their life's journey. So I've really had the opportunity to grow religiously, grow personally, grow professionally over all these through all these years. And one way or another, it's the passion to be able to support others in what, in their journeys, whatever those journeys may be.
Rabbi Edward Bernstein: I know you've certainly paid your dues, Bryan, in terms of clinical work. And I'll mention that our prior guest on NeshamaCast Alison Kestenbaum Chaplain, colleague of ours. She was my CPE teacher for a unit. And it was online during the height of the pandemic in 2020. And you were president of NAJC. And you came on to our graduation session in full scrubs, cause you had just met with a Covid patient. And I just have this image of you in full scrubs attending our CPE graduation. So I can vouch that you've paid your dues clinically.
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: Thank you. I mean, it was definitely a time for sure. And opened a lot of eyes. In a lot of different ways.
Edward Bernstein: Right? Right? And I also have had the honor of meeting your father, Doctor Barry Kinzbrunner, who has lectured and spoken about bioethics and palliative care.
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: I guess I should add one other point cause you were talking about. I don't want to call lineage or Yichus, it’s not same thingcause in a certain way I kind of pave the way. On the other hand, it was always more. It was always a wish. But my father and my uncle and my brother subsequently, or while I was in smicha all well, my uncle, my father gets me her later on, and my brother also gets me a little later on into his career. He's a he's a few years younger than me. My father had always wanted to be a rabbi. didn't have the chance when he was younger but did it later, and so in a way, I forged it. On the other hand, he forged it so it's kind of like a there's a dual, it's a double. It's a 2 sides of the same coin, if you will. But I just want to acknowledge that as well. And really there both my parents impetus. And I've said this at various NAJC Conferences when I've had the opportunity somehow.
I even you know II go back and like you know, I was a stubborn teenager. Somehow I guess I picked up enough good things, and have watched enough that I became the person I am. And I think what Charlie was saying. The same point is when you watch your parents do whatever they're doing, whether it's in the chaplaincy or whatever professional world. Hopefully you gain those life lessons that can carry forth in whatever you do. So I just want to put that out there as well.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: Yeah. So having laid the foundation with some of the life lessons you've both learned. I want to jump in to our topic at hand. Bryan, there had been prior iterations of the journal for Jewish spiritual care. What is the history of the publication prior to its current reboot? And what brought about its current reboot?
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: Actually, it's funny you should ask that question. So you're actually speaking to the 2 prior editors of this journal. I'll tell you my quick story about how I got into this. I, Charlie, had been the editor. I don't remember how many years you'll fill this in after I finish my story, Charlie, I had just started on the board in 2011 and we were at our mid Year Board Meeting, and I think Charlie had just taken a step back from the journal. At that point he had been the editor of a couple of previous issues. I remember.
I had submitted a couple of things before that, and somebody mentioned we need a new editor of the journal, and I again I was new on the board but I'm always been into writing into working on the editing and stuff. So I said you know, that might be something for me to take on board portfolio, you know. and so I volunteered, and we II forget how many we put out. I feel like we put up between 2 to 3 editions over the next 2 years. In 2013 I was approached to become the next NAJC conference chair at that point and I, which I accepted and we really didn't find an editor. So the journal went away.
It was at a time, honestly, when people were trying to people who are writing seriously, we're trying to get published in other journals so that chaplaincy could get out there in the broader community. And I remember having a few conversations, people saying, Not sure we need our own specific one when we need, when time is critical, people don't have a lot of time and they want. And if they're gonna write, they want to write for something that's gonna get them out there.
And so it really went away for a long time, and I always had this feeling of like, we didn't really a sunset it well, but B. Why did it really have to go away because there's other things to be writing. You know. Peer review journals are wonderful. Research is wonderful. but we also need a place for chaplains to write about the quality parts of chaplaincy, the stories, the lessons, and in our particular case, the interface of our religion, faith, spirituality with our professional lives as chaplains. And so, even when I was President. I kept kind of like saying we should probably try to bring this back but I didn't really have a fully formulated idea on my end.
And then, when I became past President, I approached our president to be at the time Joe, Joe Zarowski, and I said, I think it's time to revive this, and he said, exactly and I said I would love to take this on. He said yes to that, and Charlie agreed to join me as the co-editor. So I actually wanna turn to him and see if he can fill in some more of the history instead of how we got to here today.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: Yeah, please do, Charlie.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz:I guess around 2001 or something like that I was immediately asked to become part of the editorial board of the Journal. It had been in existence for maybe 2, 3, 4 years before that and I was eventually the assistant under Rothi and I was editor for I think 3 or 4 years, maybe a little bit more, maybe a little bit less. I don't remember but I know that I put out 3 or 4 issues a year on various topics. And it came to the point that I was asked to hand it over to Bryan to take over. But I guess I was involved from like Volume 3 through Volume 12. I think that's when you took over something like that. It took us a while, Bryan and I during Covid, to get this re-started and I guess that's all I'll say. That's probably enough right?
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: That's interesting, Charlie. The way that like we both remember pieces like clearly goes to how like memories are. But also, I think it's interesting that the history of this journal, I mean. there's a lot of patchy parts to it as you can clearly, hear, like how it evolved and how it came about, and how many issues there are even. I mean, it's amazing. I had some of the old ones at home. They tackle all different kinds of topics, some very challenging topics you know, various ethical topics that we have experienced over the years, and including this one that we'll get to, you know, the one that we just published that we'll get to in a moment. But it says a lot about what it's it's value was. And also, I think, what was lost when you stop something when something goes away again. There was a lot of reasons why it went away. Media has changed. I mean the fact that we're doing a voice, for, you know, voice discussion versus just a written document that's going to be able to not just be live.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz:I was editor when when NAJC decided to stop making paper journal and to put it totally online. So that was one of the things that I did wa, take it online.
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: Forget the paper part which I think is important as well. Paper versus online, butyou can see it now with more peer review journals, the rolling journal versus the final product. Here's a volume. right? That was a debate we were having for a bunch of years should be, we should be writing. But how should it look until we came back around to let's put out something. Let's not just do something rolling. Let's put out something.
Bryan Kinzbrunner: Well, we had a we had a few years when it was, you know, that there were some articles that went into the Newsletter.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz:I I really think that it's a very. It's a very important thing, and it certainly is. I think, for both of us. It's a piece of what we are in our call. You know that we feel that the you know it's the need to do this.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: So yeah, I want to get more into that. Bryan, you had referenced earlier. How many of our chaplain colleagues are publishing in journals of larger circulation to a broader audience, and we had Chaplain Allison Kastenbaum on a prior episode of Nashama Cast, and she talked about her role as a researcher who has published in many of these peer reviewed journals that you referenced. And yet what I’m hearing is that there’s also a need for Jewish chaplains to tell the story of Jewish spiritual care, which is the function that this journal serves. So I want to delve more into that.
Charlie, the new issue of the journal that was just published focuses as a unifying theme on the response of Jewish chaplains to the COVID-19 pandemic. It started, you know late 2019. That's why it's called COVID-19. But really vast majority of us felt the effects of it starting in February or March of 2020, and there was a major lock down, and that lasted for upwards of a year, and we're still feeling the effects of the covid pandemic. In the journal's introduction, you describe the use of narrative psychology that the different authors included in this issue employ to share their stories. So, Charlie, what is narrative psychology? And why was it important to dedicate this issue to narrative psychology accounts of the COVID-19 pandemic.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: You know, as a people, narrative stories are an essential part of how we express our faith. How we live our lives as Jews. The narrative part is the importance of story. The psychology part is really the essence of what we do as chaplains. You know we are working on life story pieces, and how that affects a human being in various ways. Certainly in Hospice a major part of Hospice is doing a live story piece review and in rabbinical school, you know, at Tiferet Israel. We were taught, you know, they didn't know about clinical pastoral education. They knew about clinical, pastoral psychology and the importance of story and we were taught to engage individuals going through traumatic events by using story to get some sense of who and what they are. That's why I that's why I use purposely the words narrative psychology in thein it. Because certainly Covid was a major changing point for all the individuals, for you know I mean, at Caring Hospice we start. We thought we started to see something back in January.
And so, as of January 1 that year we were wearing masks and gloves and throwing them out after every visit.We knew something was coming. And when it came we all saw the effect of overwhelmed hospitals, of suddenly doing telehealth. You know. I mean, you know, for a good part of 3 years I sat at my dining room table in my overly hot apartment, in a T shirt and and pair of shorts, but still finding a way to make those connections one on one with my patients and their families.
And both Bryan and I knew it changed a lot of how we do chaplaincy. And quite frankly, I'm still having patience die of Covid. As I was doing my training of my of the chaplains that I work with and doing the pat, the spiritual care that I do with all the staff members at caring. There was a lot of change, and there was a lot of things we had to learn how to do and to make that sacred connection between ourselves and our patients. And. you know, helping our nurses get through this this horror, and I think it's changed. It's changed to a chaplaincy forever.
Rabbi Edward Bernstein: Yeah. And just to give one more shout-out to our colleague, Chaplain Alison Kestenbaum. When she was talking on NashamaCast about the role of a researcher. There are. There's she talked about quantitative research and qualitative research. So it seems to me that narrative psychology and the format that the journal took, at least in this issue, is focusing on qualitative research.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: It’s definitely qualitative research. would. I would add that that our journal in the past had research articles from, you know, various members of our NAJC. I mean, I know that I purposely published the research that I did over the years in the Journal, not going to a bigger name journal because I thought that was important for us to have it for ourselves.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: I want to make a point. And then, Bryan, I want you to jump in a qualitative research or narrative psychology, I don't think should be dismissed as something that's different or less than research. It is a form of qualitative research that we, as chaplains are using to improve our our field. Is that is that right?
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: And it's something that we've always used as one of our tools. You know it is. It is. you know, in some ways, peer reviewed qualitative research is what it really ended up being so.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: Yeah, Bryan, please jump in.
Bryan Kinzbrunner: Just make a little bit of a tweak on the words qualitative research, because in the current more academically oriented journals, when they talk about qualitative research, there's still a quantitative aspect to it. It's it is based on narratives and anecdotals that then if you look at a lot of the articles are still the statistical analyses, and so on.
What we're doing here, and I, and in a way we will continue to do here is let's get the human element back into it, too. I remember at one of our conferences I went to. Actually it was, It was re Rafael Goldstein's session that he did many years ago. our former executive director or former member, fortunately passed away a couple of years ago, who talked about this topic of writing for academia for these peer review journals, and I remember, like he felt he was describing the tension of research. But research is very for lack of a very better word, it's bland.
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It’s important. But it doesn't read like us. It's not a story, it's information. and it's important information. And yet there's something that's sort of lacking. Now, these other journals. Some of them will include reflective pieces, and some won't but they're always tucked away in the bottom. Here Journal of Jewish Spiritual Care in general. This issue, particularly is, here's the human stories during COVID-19, whether in an article form where we had, we had we had a poem in there? In some sort of reflective manner, something tied into that time period. That comes to fill in the other gap, right? And I think that the qualitative piece that I refer to is the quality of what we do is not just in the bigger sense, but it's in the individualized moment to moment encounters that we have, and wherever world or mode and modality of work we do. that's the quality, the other that has to be brought into the puzzle as well.
Then, as I said before, then add in the Jewish piece and I don't mean that secondarily, but add in our own voices and our own language, and our own textual encounters that have to then be brought back into it. That makes the uniqueness. I would also add, you know I did mention people do want to write, for journals, you know. But again, as Charlie mentioned before, not enough people are writing. and they don't necessarily know the avenues to write 4. And so here's an avenue that I can write the reflective essay versus. I have to write it just the detailed research essay which we want as well. We want all of that. and they're all equal. I'm saying that also as a long-term goal, of this bringing it back is, let's take on all these different elements and pieces and put them together. Maybe it's ambitious, but that's my goal. I don't know.
Rabbi Edward Bernstein: Charlie, you write in this issue of the journal in in your piece that in 1, 2 month period, during the height of the Covid pandemic, your patient population declined from a 160 to 100, even in a hospice program. That is a massive loss. I'd like to explore a little more deeply with you. What was the personal toll that that took on you in your chaplaincy and as a person. And how did you manage in your chaplain work?
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: Well, I mean I one of the things that I did. And still I'm doing is that II started putting like a prayer poem at the beginning of the work day of all the staff. because I wanted them to have some kind of focus as they went out there.
You know, at 1 point we had 70% of our staff who were infected. It was a lot of you know. To me it was. It was difficult, because I not only was trying to do my own self stuff inside my head. but I was taking care of not only my patients and their families. But I was taking care of all the staff from the director down because it was he was just so traumatic seeing. you know at 1 point at you know my case load fluctuates. anyway. But at one point I had, you know, close to 60 patients and within a month I had 30 or less and it was listening to nurses who were crying on the phone with me, trying to find something within themselves so that they could go into those rooms again.
And trying to teach the other chaplains. How do we? You know? How do we handle that double load? I think partially because I grew up in this stuff you know. I mean, I had enough that Dad had taught me because I mean working at Calvary was not easy for those 2 generations. They were, you know, you know, all your patients die, you know.
But I think also part of it for me personally, is the musar piece. There's a lot of psychology in Musar. There's a lot of pre-preparation before you pray. There's pre-preparation before you'll walk into a room to do whatever you're going to do and there's a lot of after the fact which you have to do inside yourself to be able to handle all that stuff, and I guess that's about the best answer I can give you.
Edward Bernstein: Bryan, our colleague Rabbi Ben Weinberg, who is also an NAJC Board member contributed an essay to the journal titled “Making Space. A reflection on Coronavirus,” Rabbi Weinberg talks about the role of a chaplain in making space for the people we serve in chaplaincy to address the matters that are on their mind.
Bryan, what does the metaphor of making space mean to you? And what was the role of making space for patience, for fellow staff members, for really anyone during the COVID-19 lockdown as you experienced it.
Bryan Kinzbrunner: Making space. You know. It's funny that that's the that's funny metaphor when you're dealing with Lockdown. Right? The very nature of lockdown is making space and questions about how we made space? And I'll even be so bold as to say, did we make too much space literally? And how that all played out? I think we're gonna be thinking about for a long time. But making space in this context is twofold. you know, when we're doing the work of let's when we're doing hospice work, senior care work working with people in the later years of their lives, we’re entering their space, and we're entering it as strangers in the sense that. Yes, one day we'll be on the other side of that. You know. Hopefully, we should all live long enough to be on the other side of that, in a way, but we're a stranger to it.
So in a general world we walk in. They're the person we're caring for. We were there as that: listening ear, that caring person, that spiritual provider, etc. Then you bring it into something that everybody's dealing with. And all of a sudden you're both in the same boat.
With hospice like like Charlie, you know, it was a lot of telehealth. If you will. A lot of phone calls to families a lot of trying to figure out how to navigate you know the person's dying. Can they be there not be there, etc.. in the assisted living world, it was a little bit more interesting because I was able to be with people. But again, as Ed, you pointed earlier, you know, I was just up in full garb, or I think you know it looked like a spacesuit at some point. To be honest, I mean, if people can't make that joke.
Anyways, I do make that joke sometimes. It did look a little bit like a spacesuit, but you could be present to people in the sense you could still be in certain radio, you know certain distance but you were walking in not as a stranger, but you were walking in as the as another person in that same story, regardless of what was going on in the room. Because everybody knows that there's that elephant in the room which is this covid thing right you could be. You could be bringing in without knowing it. They could have it. And you could get, you know, all those different things going through your mind. I remember our past President before me, or President before me, Sandra Katz, I had a conversation with I think. And we were talking about this, and you know, what does it look like? And I said, You know, the truth is, at the beginning, especially, you know. I can't imagine anybody who didn't have some anxiety about walking into that space. And I remember in this conversation with her and saying, You know I'm feeling anxious about it. She goes: that's fine. When you walk in that space. I'm paraphrasing. So this is not a direct quote, but it' okay to bring that anxiety with you because they have that anxiety, and you have that anxiety. Let acknowledge it. And the way she put it was being non anxious presence, not be an unanxous presence, but a non anxious presence meeting once we acknowledge that feeling well, then, we can make the space that we need to make from the beginning. So the making space during Covid is really the was really a twofold process. In my eyes. Was that perfect? Not at all.
Did that create a lot of other? Has that created a lot of other issues that we are, you know, again, we're still trying to dig out. Yes, we are even all these years later. But that would be what making spaces to me in a nutshell? Especially in that moment.
0:59:03.140 --> 00:59:09.890
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: I think that the making space also stems from the fact that I always think about the sacred space around the bed, about round the bed. And what that means, you know, it's sort of like Moses, you know, taking off his sandals at the burning bush. But it's the making space part is also a religious conscious action. And the making space was how we expanded that because we had to so that the making space was expanding that sacred space around the bed through the telephone lines, you know, and whatever or wearing the PPE and how that affected when you walked into that holy space. But I think that's part of it as well.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: Charlie, in addition to the journal containing narrative prose, this issue of the journal also includes poetry, particularly a beautiful poem “being the spiritual link” by our colleague grabbed by Andrea Gauze. Let’s listen to Andrea read her poem in her own voice,” followed by the poem. The full text of the poem is in the journal on p. 18: https://najc.org/wp-content/uploads/2023/12/2023.12-Journal-of-Jewish-Spiritual-Care-A-Rebirth-FINAL.2.pdf.
Eyes:
Searching
Pleading
Weary
The Light of Hope Dimming
Hands:
Moving with Purpose
Fluttering aimlessly
Reaching out
Trying to Hold On
Breath:
Short Gasps
Fractured
Hurried
Getting too caught up to breathe
Patient, Caregiver:
Each caught in the same cycle
Each mirroring the other
Each synchronous with the other
When looking at the eyes, hands, breath:
Which is which?
Chaplain:
Standing in the intersection
Pulled by both the patient and caregiver
Struggling, straining,
Being the bridge
Over the abyss
The bridge that connects them
On a deeper level than their physical
Holding them up
Creating holy, sacred space
Providing hope, the ability to hold on
and reaching across to create the spiritual link.
Rabbi Edward Bernstein: The chaplain as a bridge is a powerful metaphor. It reminds me of the Hebrew term for chaplaincy, livuy rukhani. Spiritual accompaniment, in which we, as chaplains, escort some one from one side of a threshold to another.
What is the role of poetry in a journal on Jewish spiritual care? And what if any additional thoughts do you have on Andrea's poem.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: Like everything else that we do, every visit that I make include some form of poetry and prayer and some form of me singing. You know there's a reason why every important story in Torah as a prose version and a poetry version. The expansion of how we deal with everything that we deal. It needs different elements in writing, you know. It's the narrative. It's the poetry.
01:02:19.220 --> 01:02:24.990
If we could figure out a way to put the song in there, too. We probably would, too. But I know after speaking to her that she felt that the best way that she could reflect on how we were dealing with Jewish chaplaincy during Covid was to put it into the form of a poem and she did it very well. I mean, that's the reality. And we took I did not like on other types of articles, reflections, and poetry that we included in this issue. I was a very light editor on what our colleagues gave to us. I guess that's the best answer I can give you. I don't know.
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: So I'm gonna I'm gonna piggyback on that a little bit. Cause the truth is, we're not the only journal that has ever published poetry in a research oriented journal.
You go back actually still do it. Look at the journal Pastoral Caring and Counseling, which is sort of the one of the fundamental pastoral care journals that most of us have access to and are looking through again a lot of research. There's reflection pieces. There's poetry. There's book reviews. One of my hopes to bring back. At some point, too. We try. We did that for a while. In our former iteration. But because, again, how do we get that message across you? Just listen to Andrea's words, what did we talk about just now making space right? And the chaplain sort of sitting in that abyss. That's a space that's our role bridging the gaps. Right. That's in that same genre but in a different way. I've dabbled in poetry at points earlier in my life. I may not be the most poetic of people in that sense. There are many who find poetry to be the true form of expressing what's deep inside of them.
Others find pros to be that, even though usually when you get to that point it is poetic. Most of that prose. But we'll get, we'll leave that for another discussion unto itself. But I think that that's important for us. Going forward is be that place for that poetic reflection, too.
Because that's just as important.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: That's why I use that morning poetry, poetry, prayer, to the staff every morning for the last 3 plus years. That's the best way to convey and to set person in that space and on that bridge that we walk constantly. You know.
Edward Bernstein: How often do you plan to publish the journal? And what do you have lined up for future issues or any specific themes that you plan to cover.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: Bryan, you want to take that first.
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: 'm hoping that we'll get at least 2 issues in 24. So I, presuming this is coming up very shortly. Our next issue working title again. We'll probably tweak it by the end. Would be Jewish chaplaincy changing during war and rising anti-semitism, really a place for us to do the reflection of how our lives have been. And since October seventh as chaplains, as people who work in multi faith institutions as people who are balancing those 2. You know the personal and professional struggles.
But I will also say, and then I'll get to like deadline. The deadline piece is that themes. Issues having themes are very important and a place to place. Your writing is very important. So for those who are listening. If you have something that you're interested in writing, but it's not directly along the lines of the theme we have place for that, too.
01:07:10.110 --> 01:07:22.880
Don't be stuck in a theme. because I think that that's often what would happen. What would happen in the past is we come up with a theme, and then we would either have to shoehorn things in, or we wouldn't get enough. No, let's write even if it's one page, write. You know somebody wants to write one page reflection on. you know, a case study that they had, or something. This is the place for it. Or I mentioned a book review. You read a book that you think is important to or your chaplaincy work. Maybe it's outside the box a little. Write something on that, whatever it is. And that don't mean that in a willy-nilly kind of way I mean that in a serious way. Let this be the place to put your writing in addition to the things that we want to focus on. And this is our focus now is, how are we as chaplains during this time of revising anti-semitism? My goal, and Charlie, we we're still kind of hashing this out by email today. That's why, I'm saying my goal isto collect this over the next couple of months and get it out. Hopefully I would say by mid-year, so that we can then do a second one that'll get out. Towards the end of the year we'll have to come up with a topic for that. But that's really the goal.
That's really the ideal. I don't think, you know. Yeah, people could try to do 4 year. I think. You know, there's a place for that, too. But right now let's let's be ambit. Let's let our ambition be one at a time. But hopefully, two this year I don't know if you wanna add anything to that, Charlie, but that's sort of my pitch to everybody who's listening today.
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: Well, I mean I to me. I think that, given how long it took us to get this one out. I think it's a I think it's a realistic goal to say 2 issues for 24, and that's great. And certainly, as in the past, just like Bryan said, you know. We want, you know, if you if you have something you really want to say. if you have a book that you want to review for us. You have a poem that you want to write for us--we will fit it in. You know a theme does not mean that the entire journal issue has to be only on that you know you will. In my entire rabbinate, I have always encouraged rabbis and chaplains to put stuff down on paper, because you have something important to say. You've experienced something that maybe somebody hasn't seen in the same way. You went through it.
You know my ancestors certainly wrote lots of different types of types of books and tractates. And what have you? And you know Grandpa and dad, certainly they wrote serious research stuff and they wrote stuff on Torah, Talmud and what have you. It all came out because it was something important to get out there, and that's what we really want to encourage. That we want our colleagues to. Part of the reason of the issue took so long to get out is that we didn't. We weren't successful in encouraging our colleagues and friends of NAJC to put something down on paper. It's not length. It's, you know if it's a reflection, and it's just, you know. 1, 2, 3 pages, that's fine, you know. But if it's something that you are dying to comment on. Put it down on paper and give it to us.
Edward Bernstein: Yeah. So to our colleagues who are listening, send our editors your written pieces, Bryan and Charlie, as we arc toward a conclusion. It's interesting that you've referenced, we've talked about the first issue of the rebooted journal focusing on COVID-19 and anticipation that the next issue will focus on our work as chaplains in the aftermath of October seventh. it seems like we and the people we serve are careening from one crisis to another.
As a closing thought, could you each address what keeps you grounded and able to keep going in the midst of going from one crisis to another?
Rabbi Charles Rabinowitz: I think first of all, it's my family. I'm a very, very lucky man. My wife is an incredible woman. And my children are very special to me. When I get home, they know me well enough that they know what you know to give me the space and the time, and to support me in the way that I do.
Wendy often says that she doesn't worry about me if she hears me singing. Okay. And I have a number of things that I do for my own self to make sure that I can get through all these kind of crises. You know I'm the oldest member of the Larchmont Temple softball team. Okay coaching first base, because I ,can't quite do anything more at this point at this point. But you know I'm a member with my daughter of the walk about Clearwater chorus which Pete Seeger founded many decades ago to bring the message of the clear water onto land.
So there are things that I do, and the things that I am supported by. You know.
I'm also lucky that I'm a member of a synagogue that allowed us to stay after my time was up and we've been very active members at large of our Temple and we've been very well supported for all the work that we do for temple, and we're supported very much by a very special rabbi or 2. And that's how I keep on going, you know.
Edward Bernstein: Thank you, Bryan?
Bryan Kinzbrunner: I'll try to be very brief on this. I think I think there are couple of things I would say is, one is. you know. I think Charlie hit it on the head is having strong foundational pieces to life. Whether it's family, whether it's community whether it's fulfillment. I think those things help us through it. I think it's important to recognize the things that we can do and the things that we can't do.
01:15:13.730 --> 01:15:31.640
I I'm not one of those, you know. I said this on a different podcast. But I am one of those that doom scrolls. It is true, so. I'm not one of those who's gonna say don't doom scroll, but I think at the same time it's important to recognize the limits for ourselves. If that becomes too much, well, stop. And I don't mean that in a you know again, sort of like a quick fix kind of answer. But how do we deal with crisis? Is we have to know who we are in our limits, and what we can and cannot handle and, and be forgiving when we push ourselves a little bit further.
These are lessons I learned from myself, I mean, I learned some last few years a lot of those things. Still learning them. I think we're always learning them.
And I think in this particular case this current crisis moment is just reminding us of that sometimes we have to look internally, too, and we can't just look externally, and sometimes you have to look externally and internally at the same time. And that's a very broad conversation but it's important. That's why I said community so important, Charlie. You said it so well.
You know, when you think about the synagogue you're part of in the Jewish community or part of again, your community, my communities, wherever you know and anybody's community. Is that giving us a place and a space? And I think that's been very important for me as well, and in my case is also just seeing. You know I'm around. As I said, I'm around kids all day now, or half the day, I guess. It's very inspiring and very powerful in new ways that I didn't even realize and that just shows life. You know, there's still life. There's still life we're still doing. We're living, we're laughing, we're smiling. And yet, you know, we're also hoping and praying that these things end. However, we want them to end. We're hoping and praying that they end and that they end in the least harmful way possible is the best way I would put it. Cause there's always harm doesn't matter how, but least harmful way.
Rabbi Edward Bernstein: Yeah, Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner and Rabbi Charlie Rabinowitz are the co-editors of the newly rebooted Journal of Jewish Spiritual Care, published by Nashama Association of Jewish Chaplains Bryan and Charlie--thank you. So much for coming on NeshamaCast. May you be blessed to continue to touch the souls and warm the hearts of every one you counter.
Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner: Thank you, it’s been a pleasure.
Rabbi Charlie Rabinowitz: Thank you for the opportunity to do this.
Rabbi Ed Bernstein: NeshamaCast is a production of Neshama: Association of Jewish Chaplains.
Thank you to Rabbi Charlie Rabinowitz and Rabbi Bryan Kinzbrunner for being our guests. Thank you to Rabbi Andrea Gauze for reading her poem, “Being a spiritual link.”Check out our show notes for a link to the current issue of Journal of Jewish Spiritual Care.
Special thanks for technical and logistical support to Rabbi Katja Vehlow, Allison Atterberry, NAJC Acting Executive Director, and Rabbi Drew Kaplan and the NAJC Social Media Committee.
Transcripts for this episode and other episodes of NeshamaCast are available at NeshamaCast.simplecast.com.
Our theme Music is “A Niggun For Ki Anu Amecha,” written and performed by Reb-Cantor Lisa Levine.
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